about todays update

[cmec]

@Lineage2Ertheia
whats going on, this balancing is so bad
now dagger kills red mob in dragon valley for 2mins (if not using all limits like AAoD+shirt+talismans)
isnt it kinda too excessive? - its already class which can kill only 1 target mobs, and fall behind in all farms, so he had only 1 thing - cleaning champs, now he doesnt even have that
also drops didnt increase but difficulty increased by alot in dragon valley, while difficulty increased in phantasmal is kinda good against botters(clicker users or what ever you want to call them) it took 8mins to kill mobs with 2 dreadnoughts +healer +iss debuffs using all limits on cooldown so idk if its even worth - im not even imagining new players with lower gear needing 7 tanks constantly on ud/party ud + 2 healers and a cc of 10-20 parties to kill whole area of phantasmal

[Lineage2Ertheia]

@Lineage2Ertheia
whats going on, this balancing is so bad
now dagger kills red mob in dragon valley for 2mins (if not using all limits like AAoD+shirt+talismans)
isnt it kinda too excessive? - its already class which can kill only 1 target mobs, and fall behind in all farms, so he had only 1 thing - cleaning champs, now he doesnt even have that
also drops didnt increase but difficulty increased by alot in dragon valley, while difficulty increased in phantasmal is kinda good against botters(clicker users or what ever you want to call them) it took 8mins to kill mobs with 2 dreadnoughts +healer +iss debuffs using all limits on cooldown so idk if its even worth - im not even imagining new players with lower gear needing 7 tanks constantly on ud/party ud + 2 healers and a cc of 10-20 parties to kill whole area of phantasmal

Thankyou for your input.
We have tested for almost 1 day regarding balancing of these areas, mainly increase in drops by 50% and resistances for p skill critical damage/hp by around 20-30% in dragon valley and dagger resistance increased in dragon valley monsters mainly.   Please keep in mind that the rewards increased, to match the longer time it would take to kill monsters. Also othel damage is exponential, the better buffs make a huge difference, especially regarding critical damage that has more then 1000-2000% bonuses for your class and are impacted greatly, probably also a cause why you feel bigger impact in champion red mobs.

1. Issue 1 Dragon Valley - your concern is about Red Champion Mobs being too difficult for dagger class to kill or normal mobs?

About Red Champion mobs - the time should not have doubled, i imagine this is why it feels much slower then before.  Also , the 2 minutes become 1 minutes or less if using limits and maybe less if using shirts, sayha, and pve setup.. so it is 1 minute/red mob or less .   Please keep in mind that the rewards increased, to match the longer time it would take to kill monsters. Maybe it would be better to compare the amount of items gathered in a certain amount of time.

We will either increase the drops of all red champions everywhere, or decrease in dragon valley stats of mobs, but this would impact the normal farmers also. Drop increase for red champions only furthermore 50% to make it up for the time killing it and also making Champion hunters classes that cannot aoe more worth the farm might be a long term better solution.

Also killing red mobs can be fun for team players. So raising drops for red mobs will be the possible solution in few days to make things feel better for players.

Dagger class can kill normal mobs in 3-5 hits using skills in dragon valley , which is the hardest farm zone in the game, with no epic jewels (for dagger to achieve max damage should be behind the mob). Before it was killing mobs in 1 hit (no epics whatsoever and basic bufs from alt b) . Dagger classes should not use normal skills in special hunting zones like Dragon Valley, Primevil with skill critical damage resistant monsters.

Drops increased also in Primevil , Cemetary and Dragon Valley, and only p skill critical damage increased slightly (this is why othel class is the most impacted by changes since it benefits the most from p. skill crit damage increase builds), but using skills most mobs are 1 hit, or 3-4 in dragon valley (if othel class is played as should and the target is hit from behind or worst case back and other combos are used even less) - without limits, shirts, or even epic jewels but basic buffs, and maybe lv 2 fantasy at least, being and endzone.

About Champion red mobs, are you talking about killing them using skills or normal hits? Today's updates were made regarding abuse 1 hit kill of dagger class in dragon valley and other areas, champions were not  a concern.

2. Phantasmal area is for end game party not new players at all. But indeed 8 minutes seems over the top. The defense increase will be reverted.   

PS: How long it took you before compared to the 8 minutes now?

[cmec]

2: it was 1 bers+101+brave spear +rhapsody to kill whole area with 1 tyrr (so 1min +-) now its 8 with 2 tyrrs +iss debuffs

1: time to kill red mob become not double but close to 10x it was not more than 15sec before.. problem with killing red on limits thats 1min for 1 red mob and 5mins waiting for amazing angel of death, shirt 30min, talisman abudance or savage 10mins so thats 1mob in 5mins basicly while before seeing 5-6 red mobs could have done it in 1 AAod+talisman abu+savage now if use all mentioned above you have hard time killing 2 reds, i doubt that drops increased that much to counter that time spent..
im still standing on what i said before - dagger is lowest farm income class because of 1target killer, and him being nerf like this now becomes useless to do smth with it outside of rb's/instances, theres no use of dagger class in any farm..
also didnt try yet to go with tyrr to dragon valley but if its same storry with a tyrr thats dirrect force to play mages

also on the same note there arent that much red mobs, unless some weaker player was farming and left bunch of them standing because he couldnt kill it, its not like dagger goes to dragon valley and every 5mins he sees 50reds.. its not like that, some1 need to be farming there before dagger can even have a chance on those red mobs

best comparison and probably best balanced spot is primeval island for all classes
tyrr can farm ~1500 ethers on outside spots in 1 hour, dagger can go farm tyranosauruses and reds if there are some there and make ~800-900 in same hour, while its lower than tyrr its still some viable farm, every other spot dagger farms 20x less even with red mobs compared to aoe classes

also an example when i was farming feathers for my daggers it took me more than a day farming with a dagger to get that 1000 feathers, when i was making set friend tyrr came and we made same 1k in less than an hour me killing reds and him killing all the rest for faster farm.. thats how bad farm with dagger is and now him nerfed like that makes it even worse

[cmec]

not only in dragon valley but everywhere dagger became useless.. he cant kill champs anywhere, 0 dmg on all mobs which is champ, guess its really time to start playing mage
with this change soon enough all spots will be just red mobs with no ppl to clean them, because its not even worth the time of killing reds anymore, drop is barrely 2x of normal mob and takes 20x time

[Lineage2Ertheia]

not only in dragon valley but everywhere dagger became useless.. he cant kill champs anywhere, 0 dmg on all mobs which is champ, guess its really time to start playing mage
with this change soon enough all spots will be just red mobs with no ppl to clean them, because its not even worth the time of killing reds anymore, drop is barrely 2x of normal mob and takes 20x time

In few days we ll rebalance again, having in mind to improve this aspect of the game, the role of othel in killing red champion mobs effectivly, without being overpowered for normal mobs.

So this topic is about killing red champion mobs specifically in the end game zone.

red mob drops is currently set at 8x normal mob.  will be set even higher, at  x10 .

 We ll see how to improve the role of dagger killing only champion type red mobs somehow.

[cmec]

what was wrong with it yesterday to completely make it useless today? him killing mobs 1shot shouldnt be an issue, because its his role - assassin
it doesnt matter he 1shots mobs or 20shots them, he's still the slowest farmer in the game..

[Lineage2Ertheia]

what was wrong with it yesterday to completely make it useless today? him killing mobs 1shot shouldnt be an issue, because its his role - assassin
it doesnt matter he 1shots mobs or 20shots them, he's still the slowest farmer in the game..

It was brought to our attention some people abused the fact that monsters were too easy to kill and rewards too small. We tested,except the aspect of champions. As a result some resistances increased for end game hunting zones only and rewards substantially increased to reflect these changes and make farming overall less time consuming and more enjoyable.

[cmec]

i dont know what you tested and how..
as for now tyrr farms the same as it was before (maybe a little bit slower) while dagger nerfed to the ground.. he cant kill champs, he farms way less than tyrrs or mages.. so dagger became useless class in pve except against bosses, but even so you nerfed that too, because now can make damage only from behind, flanks dont get bonus anymore, which means if cant stun or dont have a tanker to be able to hit back every time dagger lost significant amount of damage

nicely done.. now nerf tyrr mage and archer the same way, and we gonna farm with healers and isses

[Lineage2Ertheia]

i dont know what you tested and how..
as for now tyrr farms the same as it was before (maybe a little bit slower) while dagger nerfed to the ground.. he cant kill champs, he farms way less than tyrrs or mages.. so dagger became useless class in pve except against bosses, but even so you nerfed that too, because now can make damage only from behind, flanks dont get bonus anymore, which means if cant stun or dont have a tanker to be able to hit back every time dagger lost significant amount of damage

nicely done.. now nerf tyrr mage and archer the same way, and we gonna farm with healers and isses

Othell class is not a farming class and has specific mechanics why the impact of the update feels as a big nerf, however, the idea of making him a champion highly efficient hunter is a good idea and will be improved, if not reverted. As we speak is being worked on and test. Our tests were made on a test server with the mirror images of live players with top gear and medium gear.

About the Shadow Hunter skill, it was tackled in another topic (will be reverted in few days) boosting furthermore it s pve capability.

The thing about optimizations is that it has unintended consequences, but without it, there would be no updates. That is why we have a forum where players can feedback and we all can find a good solution to improve the overall game quality.

[cmec]

i dont know what you tested and how..
as for now tyrr farms the same as it was before (maybe a little bit slower) while dagger nerfed to the ground.. he cant kill champs, he farms way less than tyrrs or mages.. so dagger became useless class in pve except against bosses, but even so you nerfed that too, because now can make damage only from behind, flanks dont get bonus anymore, which means if cant stun or dont have a tanker to be able to hit back every time dagger lost significant amount of damage

nicely done.. now nerf tyrr mage and archer the same way, and we gonna farm with healers and isses

Othell class is not a farming class and has specific mechanics why the impact of the update feels as a big nerf, however, the idea of making him a champion highly efficient hunter is a good idea and will be improved, if not reverted. As we speak is being worked on and test. Our tests were made on a test server with the mirror images of live players with top gear and medium gear.

i still dont understand what are you talking about
how if othel isnt farming character they level up in official servers? how? - i can tell you
they are first to go to top zones from the begining of H5
on h5 they were first farming knoricks and kariks with a party of 2-3 othels lethaling/half killing them
on god they were first with a party to farm riders crosroads
when helios update came - they were first soloing at supperion fortress
at fafurion they were first soloing in atelia underground and then at fafurion

idk what you are talking about about them being not farming characters.. they were first to everywhere, to the strongest mobs of the game and they done it with ease making close amount of xp as aoe characters did on lower spots, your doing makes him not farming class for sure because one thing he has is to clean strongest mobs in the game and you mutulated that big time, even not pvp class as of shadow hunter being nerfed like that
in pvp you not always can hit from behind, specially with characters stacked on stun resists if cant land a stun then 99% skill goes to flank(side of hero) which means as of now its has 0 added damage - even when other classes have aoe skills to kill at same pvp around them (tyrr with eruption/huricane storm, mage with his aoes, archer with multishot or arrow rain) so its a nerf to a class which can only kill 1target no matter how you look at him